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  #1  
Old 12-05-2012, 12:44 PM
Eagle Eagle is offline
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Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 6
Default Windows Updates Blocked?

About 6 or 8 weeks ago I started having trouble doing Windows Updates. The updates just wouldn't download. The percent meter just sat there at zero. The blinking receive lights on the Xplornet modem stopped blinking as if there was no download activity. This issue occurred on my both desktop and my new laptop computer. For several days I tried all kinds of fix-it solutions from the Microsoft site but nothing worked. I finally took my laptop to a friends house who has real high speed (not Xplornet) and the updates worked just fine. I repeated this scenario the next time there were Windows Updates and again they wouldn't download over my Xplornet connection but worked just fine from my fiends house. I called Xplornet to see what was going on and they simply wouldn't give me an answer. When I asked to get bumped up to a higher level of support the guy refused. He vaguely stated that some some sites my be blocked and that I may have to do the updates in the middle of the night. I tried doing the updates after midnight and they downloaded no problem. I have repeated this several times and after midnight it suddenly works.

If this is a change in policy for Xplornet you would think they would have the common decency to inform it's customers and suggest a solution for them.

Is anyone else having problems downloading Windows Updates.

If I had any other option to get high speed internet where I live I would drop Xplornet in an instant. They really do suck big time.
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  #2  
Old 12-05-2012, 01:51 PM
buttitchi buttitchi is offline
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Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 213
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Sounds like Xplornet blocked it to avoid people doing security updates(large or small) during busy time, since it work after midnight. Or its shitty configuration that blocks via protocol without providing exceptions.
Without checking, Microsoft may be using FTP(tcp to check for specific updates) and Xplornet may see that as filesharing and for the hell of it blocks during high usage times.
Edit: plug direct into the Xplornet modem to ensure your routers firewall is not blocking anything if there is time settings for blocking certain things at certain times of day.
Xplornet does have some documentation of them blocking certain things during the day and not blocking overnight.

Here is an alternate method to download the monthly update packs in some posts.
http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/w...c-6d7c443cdf8a

Specific post
Quote:

options -

Security updates are available on ISO-9660 CD image files from the Microsoft Download Center
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/913086

Microsoft bulletin summary for the updates for the current month:
http://www.microsoft.com/technet/security/current.aspx
Since this is a major security problem, contact the.....
Commissioner for complaints for telecommunications services.
http://www.ccts-cprst.ca/
I suppose your anti-virus updates still work?
Imagine all those people who shut down their systems overnight and they have not been getting Windows updates for months and are now vulnerable for all sorts of things. Xplornet being the one to blame for blocking an important security feature. Considering that the block may also blocking encrypted traffic and any ISP who interferes with encrypted traffic needs a severe kick in the balls.

You could probably also check for a 'security vulnerability services contact' at Microsoft for help in resolving this issue.
http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/s.../cc165610.aspx
there is various contacts there for chat with virtual agents.
http://support.microsoft.com/contactus/

Wireshark
https://www.wireshark.org/
Allows you to see the traffic that your connection is doing to sites/local.
Read the documentation files on its site to decipher all the data that will be displayed.
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Hi Diddly Ho, Good Neighborino

Last edited by buttitchi : 12-05-2012 at 02:23 PM.
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  #3  
Old 12-05-2012, 06:44 PM
dave_ca dave_ca is offline
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Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 301
Default

What version of Windows are you using?

The timing component is interesting, I can see a few possibilities including throttling by the ISP or a component on your PC, or a network device on your network - or on the less likely use of a WSUS server or group policy setting.

I would recommend trying this: http://support.microsoft.com/kb/971058


And I would also continue to call the ISP until they confirm or fix the issue.
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  #4  
Old 12-06-2012, 03:02 PM
Eagle Eagle is offline
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Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 6
Default

I put my comments to your post in red text below.
Quote:
Originally Posted by buttitchi View Post
Sounds like Xplornet blocked it to avoid people doing security updates(large or small) during busy time, since it work after midnight. Or its shitty configuration that blocks via protocol without providing exceptions.
Without checking, Microsoft may be using FTP(tcp to check for specific updates) and Xplornet may see that as filesharing and for the hell of it blocks during high usage times.
Edit: plug direct into the Xplornet modem to ensure your routers firewall is not blocking anything if there is time settings for blocking certain things at certain times of day.
I did try bypassing my router and it didn't make any difference.
Xplornet does have some documentation of them blocking certain things during the day and not blocking overnight.

Here is an alternate method to download the monthly update packs in some posts. I actually did do some updates this way at first thinking it was just a one time problem. I shouldn't have to do this all the time however.
http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/w...c-6d7c443cdf8a

Specific post


Since this is a major security problem, contact the.....
Commissioner for complaints for telecommunications services.
I will try to call Xplornet again and give them a second chance to correct this before going this route. Nice to have this option though. Thanks for the link.
http://www.ccts-cprst.ca/
I suppose your anti-virus updates still work?
My anti virus updates no problem.
Imagine all those people who shut down their systems overnight and they have not been getting Windows updates for months and are now vulnerable for all sorts of things. Xplornet being the one to blame for blocking an important security feature. Considering that the block may also blocking encrypted traffic and any ISP who interferes with encrypted traffic needs a severe kick in the balls.

You could probably also check for a 'security vulnerability services contact' at Microsoft for help in resolving this issue.
http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/s.../cc165610.aspx
there is various contacts there for chat with virtual agents.
http://support.microsoft.com/contactus/

Wireshark
https://www.wireshark.org/
Allows you to see the traffic that your connection is doing to sites/local.
Read the documentation files on its site to decipher all the data that will be displayed.
I'll try the last 2 suggestions as a last resort. Thanks again for your comments.
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  #5  
Old 12-06-2012, 03:26 PM
Eagle Eagle is offline
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Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 6
Default

My comments are in red text below.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dave_ca View Post
What version of Windows are you using? I'm using Windows 7 Home Premium 64 bit on both computers.

The timing component is interesting, I can see a few possibilities including throttling by the ISP or a component on your PC, or a network device on your network - or on the less likely use of a WSUS server or group policy setting.
Sorry but I'm not sure what you what you mean by the above. The throttling by the ISP I can understand but I'm not tech savvy enough to know what component on both my new laptop and my PC could be causing a problem. Same comment for a network device. Sorry but I don't even know what a WSUS server is or a group policy setting. I will Google this and try to learn.

I would recommend trying this: http://support.microsoft.com/kb/971058
I don't want to fool with my registry if I don't have to. As a last resort maybe. I still can't see both of my computers all of a sudden having a problem that would cause Windows Updates to stop working, especially since the laptop updates just fine if I use a another ISP at a friends house.

And I would also continue to call the ISP until they confirm or fix the issue. This I am definitely going to do.
Thanks very much for responding to my post.
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  #6  
Old 01-15-2013, 02:20 PM
Eagle Eagle is offline
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Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 6
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Hereís an update to my problem with downloading Windows Updates.

Iím still having the same problem of not being able to download the updates during the day but after the peak usage hours it works.

I called Xplornet support again and lucked out this time and got a level 2 tech guy on the phone right away. This guy was actually polite and helpful. After a bit of checking he told me that Windows has changed its Windows Update site to a Peer-to-Peer type operation and that Xplornet restricts P2P traffic during peak hours as per their Fair Access Policy. He also said that Apple has done the same and that they are having the same issue with Apple downloads. He said that they need to figure out a way to allow specific sites like Windows Updates through their P2P blocking system.

Iím glad I finally got an answer. Now I know what is going on. I detest it when a company has a problem and they try and BS their way around admitting it. It really POís me when they try and blame the problem on you like the first few guys I talked to did. I still donít think itís acceptable for them to allow this to happen without finding a solution. Windows Updates are simply a critical feature that has to be maintained. This is something that Xplornet has to get resolved. I wonder how many people are now behind on their critical security updates and donít know it.

If you are having this same problem please call Xplornet and let them know that this is unacceptable and that they need to fix this. Hopefully if they get enough calls they will take this seriously.
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  #7  
Old 01-15-2013, 03:07 PM
buttitchi buttitchi is offline
offline "Global Moderator" Retired
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 213
Default

Sounds just like Rogers and their 'accidental' blocking of World of Warcraft P2P.
Configuration should be able to fix it via some type of whitelist(override throttles on signatures of WOW). It a start but not really a true fix.

https://encrypted.google.com/webhp#h...w=1417&bih=872

https://secure.dslreports.com/shownews/116160
Quote:
CRTC to Rogers: Fix Your Broken Throttling System
Regulator Gives Rogers Until September 27
by Karl Bode Friday 16-Sep-2011

As we noted last week, half of all Canadian network neutrality complaints are from Rogers users -- and most of those complaints focus on the company's bizarre inability to prevent their network management system from throttling legit applications and games like World of Warcraft. Many of our Rogers forum users have been fighting with Rogers on this issue for over a year, and are directly responsible for the CRTC recently applying pressure on the ISP to resolve this issue.

Last week Rogers responded to a CRTC inquiry by acknowledging they've accidentally throttled legitimate apps, and that their throttling system can accidentally throttle programs if they're running at the same time as P2P traffic (pirated and non-pirated content alike). In WOW's case, the game's P2P update system is apparently setting off the Rogers network alarms, something Rogers has been unable to fix. This week users in our forums note the CRTC has sent Rogers a letter (pdf) demanding the ISP resolve the problem immediately:

As a result, Commission staff requests that Rogers file a plan for resolving the possibility of misclassification of other interactive game traffic, by 27 September 2011, that includes specific steps and timelines for each step. Commission staff also requests that Rogers provide a detailed report to the Commission once the problem is resolved, demonstrating that the problem has been fixed.
The letter notes that Rogers is effectively violating Canada's new neutrality law, and that the company's current "whitelisting" approach to games and applications simply won't do. It will be interesting to see if this regulatory pressure finally cures Rogers network management incompetence.

Some information on throttling practices in Canada.
CRTC
http://www.crtc.gc.ca/eng/archive/2011/2011-609.htm
Quote:
Ottawa, 22 September 2011
Internet traffic management practices – Guidelines for responding to complaints and enforcing framework compliance by Internet service providers

In this bulletin, the Commission describes how it will respond to complaints from individual customers, telecommunications service providers, consumer advocacy groups, and industry associations about the Internet traffic management practices (ITMPs) used by Internet service providers (ISPs). The Commission also sets out the steps it will take to enforce ISPs’ compliance with the ITMP framework for retail and wholesale Internet services.
A wiki quote on Rogers and its throttling of WOW
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rogers_Hi-Speed_Internet
Quote:
Throttling

BitTorrent traffic is restricted through bandwidth throttling using equipment from Sandvine Inc, which has caused complaints as users feel Rogers is overstepping their bounds as a service provider and despite Rogers advertising their service “for sharing large files and much more”. Rogers has previously denied such allegations, despite widespread reports of the issue. Further controversy arose when in May 2007, Rogers began throttling all encrypted file transfers allegedly to combat BitTorrent traffic, but affecting all encrypted transfers regardless if they are BitTorrent traffic or not.[17] [18]

In January 2011, the CRTC issued a letter to Rogers stating it was breaking CRTC policy by not "indicat[ing] that there are circumstances whereby the Rogers ITMP will also affect download speeds available to subscribers." [19] Despite the letter from the CRTC, Rogers still had not updated their policy pages as of February 4, 2011, and continued throttling all non-whitelisted internet traffic (no longer just P2P) for up to 15 minutes after P2P had been disabled. Several games had been caught up in this more restrictive throttling as Rogers was incorrectly detecting them as P2P, and had also been slow to fix it despite offers of assistance from customers, and game manufacturers. [20]

On May 31, 2011, Rogers filed that they had resolved the World of Warcraft throttling, however they had only resolved it on their testing equipment, as users were still experiencing throttling .[21] This resulted in the CRTC ordering testing done by Rogers, and the CRTC providing the complainant (Teresa Murphy) a redacted copy of the Rogers testing. On September 22, 2011, the CRTC released Telecom Information Bulletin CRTC 2011-609, which set out new steps for complaints, and allowed for the World of Warcraft complaint to be sent to the CRTC Enforcements division. While the World of Warcraft complaint was then closed as it was resolved, the creators of the WoW complaint created a new one, which was then sent to Enforcements division, who then began looking into Rogers' throttling practices, and found additional [22] non-compliance .[23]

After Bell announced they were ending throttling in December 2011 ,[24] and the CRTC Enforcement division finding another violation of CRTC throttling policy in January 2012, Rogers announced on Feb 6, 2012 that they were ending throttling on their network by the end of 2012 .[25]
Injection of content
Rogers injects a warning message into Google.com

Since early December, 2007, Rogers has been injecting their own content into other companies' websites without permission.
__________________
Hi Diddly Ho, Good Neighborino

Last edited by buttitchi : 01-15-2013 at 03:14 PM.
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  #8  
Old 02-12-2013, 02:07 PM
Eagle Eagle is offline
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Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 6
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Update as of Feb 12, 2013
I called Xplornet again and asked about the status of this problem.
They said they are still trying to resolve it but are finding it difficult. They said they are getting lots of calls about this, which is good. Hopefully they figure something out soon.
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  #9  
Old 04-06-2013, 03:06 PM
Eagle Eagle is offline
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Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 6
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I noticed that my desktop had installed a Windows Defender Update yesterday morning at around 9:30. That's during the day, which means maybe they fixed the problem. I tried my laptop this morning and it did an update sometime around noon.

Hopefully the problem is solved.
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